[:1]To begin, these suggested changes are not my own. My personal opinions will follow after this post but as it is the most complete work of suggestion notes I've found currently on the official forms, I thought they would be useful in entering the field.
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I know a lot of this has been said before and there�s very little chance of Blizz implementing it any time soon, but I like to think and create and write (and post walls of text) so this is as much for me as it is for any of you. I will try and say not only what I want to do, but WHY I want to do it and the assumptions I�m making, so you can understand my reasoning. This post is a little long, but I have tried to make it an easy read.
Of course, I'd love to hear your thoughts/comments/suggestions.
My goal here is to increase the player�s desire to make use of the mechanics of AV without limiting their options or forcing them to follow a particular path. I am also trying to change very little with the layout and actual gameplay, and mostly just mess with the behind-the-scenes numbers so that the Blizzard programmers need to do as little work as possible if they want to use my suggestions to fix AV.
Now, on to the good stuff!
People tend to ignore a lot of what�s going on in Alterac Valley beacuse they didn�t need to worry about it, and its quicker to just run straight for the end and down the boss. This is due in large part to gear-creep; we grow more powerful as expansions progress but Vanndar and Drek'thar (hereafter referred to as General or simply "boss") stay the same. Unless Blizzard wants to be constantly readjusting health pools or finding a way to make boss-health scale with raid gear-score (both clunky, unattractive options) by the end of the Cataclysm expansion we'll be seeing the same issue.
Basically, we need to slow the battle way down, which comes in two parts: first, make the boss fight harder and the kill less important by decoupling it from instant victory; and second: increase the relative value of everything else. For the purpose of this post, assume that everything not specifically mentioned remains the same; I'll try to address as many of the mechanics as I can.
Victory: Winning should still be linked to Reinforcements (hereafter referred to simply as "R"). You need to decrease your enemies R while protecting your own, which adds a nice level of complexity to the fight above that of AB and EotS, which are simply races to the top. Each team starts out with 700 R, and has a max of 1000 R, and loses if they reach 0 R. Whenever a player dies, their team loses 1 R.
This way, a person who wants to spend the entire battle farming Honor Kills can legitimately claim they are helping their team win, so long as they get more kills than deaths.
Boss-fights: Vann and Drek each deal melee damage, but are only level X4, X9, or 85, meaning that while you need high health and armor to tank them, they wont likely crit you to death. Each boss also stacks a buff on themselves at a rate of one stack per second. When the buff reaches 10 stacks it drops off and the boss charges a random player, wiping agro; this is intended to make tanking at least a little challenging even under good circumstances, and introduce some of the PvP style randomness to a PvE encounter. If the boss kills a player the buff loses 5 stacks. Killing the enemies General causes your opponents to lose 400 R, and prevents them from gaining any more R for the duration of the battle.|||Towers: Each boss is also supported by 4 Warmasters(H) or Marshalls(A) (hereafter referred to as "battlemasters") who are each linked to a tower. Destroying a tower will cause the linked battlemaster to despawn, but killing the battlemaster directly will also cause his tower to crumble. Doing either still costs the enemy 75 R, and also reduces their maximum R by 100. Rather than just tagging a flag and then waiting 4 minutes, the rate at which the tower is destroyed depends on how many people are near the tower's flag, like capping the bases in EotS. This decouples 'damage' from gear, but still encourages players to stay and defend the tower until it breaks. Unlike EotS, there is no way to counter-cap and repair the tower. (as a hero of Azeroth, you're much better at breaking things than fixing them)
Each battlemaster buffs the boss' damage by a little and his health by a lot. Each battlemaster also has a unique ability. One battlemaster has an AOE fear, similar to the current boss ability. Another has an AOE silence. A third is a healer, who mostly heals himself and the boss, but will also toss an occasional heal on any friendly players in the room (his healing is difficult, but not impossible to out-DPS). The last battlemaster will continually cast "Summon defender" when he is in combat, which is a non-interruptible spell with a 5 second cast time. It randomly selects one friendly player and attempts to summon them to the General's defense. Just like a normal summon, the player can accept or decline. (In order to prevent load-screen issues, the player will be summoned into a DI-like bubble that must be clicked off before they can enter combat.)
Captains: Balinda Stonehearth and Galvangar remain in their respective bunkers. They periodically buff the entire team, as before, and if they are killed their faction looses 100 R. While your teams captain is alive, your movement speed is increased by 10% and you destroy enemy towers 25% faster.
Mines: Currently, each mine gives 1 R every 45 seconds. This will be buffed to 1 R per 10 seconds. Also, the units in the mine are not elite (allowing players to fight through to gather supplies), but the mine boss is, and he/she will be guarded by 2 slightly-less elite NPCs. It will require multiple people to capture the mine.
Supplies: even with an AV trinket, running back to the home base to turn in supplies takes to long for most players and costs to much offensive momentum. A forward command-post spawns at each teams farthest GY (farthest from the entrance gate) where you can turn in armor scraps, mine supplies, hides, Rams/Wolves, and Blood/Crystals. Turning in 10 armor scraps or 5 blood/crystals awards 1 R. Turning in 10 mine supplies awards 3 R.
Each time you turn in supplies, you receive bonus honor just as you would for getting an honor kill. This way if you want to spend the entire fight running mine supplies you are still helping your team and won�t lose out on honor.|||Unit Upgrades: turning in armor scraps significantly increases the strength of the NPCs who guard your graveyards and towers as well as your infantry and cavalry patrols. The NPCs start out weak, but by the time they reach Veteran status (3 upgrades) they achieve near-instance level toughness, requiring a group to fight.
You will want to upgrade them quickly, because each time an NPC dies you lose 1R.
Ground Assault, Cavalry Assault: the number of supplies needed for these is reduced, and you no longer need the quest to gather mine supplies (you can still only pick up 10 at one time though). You must also have gotten at least one Unit Upgrade to activate these assaults. Once enough supplies have been gathered, players can periodically send groups of Elite NPCs across the battlefield to engage the enemy.
Once every 3 minutes, a player can send forth a small group of infantry units which will make its way to the middle of AV (the Field of Strife) and move around in that area, attacking any enemy units that try to pass through.
Once every 4 minutes, a player can send forth a small group of cavalry units which will patrol rapidly back and forth between your home base and your forward command post, attacking any enemies it encounters.
Aerial Assault: This is a really neat idea, but with everything else going on, I recommend simply removing this one mechanic from the fight; there�s only so much players can do at one time. I would, however, like to see this mechanic brought back in some other BG. Rescuing an NPC, then picking targets for him to attack and areas to patrol sounds like an fun way to add depth to a battle.
Ultimate Unit: Players can turn in Storm Crystals or Soldiers Blood in order to eventually summon Lokholar the Ice Lord or Ivus the Forest Lord (hereafter referred to simply as "Lok-vus"). This is a major achievement, that should be almost as important as killing the enemy General. Once enough supplies have been gathered, 3 players will be required to help summon Lok-vus, who will boost your R by 200. Once summoned, Lok-vus will move towards the enemies base. Along the way, if any of the enemie's battle-master towers are still standing, he will stop and smash them to pieces.
Lok-vus has a large amount of health, but it regens slowly out of combat, acting more like an NPC vehicle than a raid boss. This means he can be zerged down, if you have sufficient DPS. If attacked, Lok-vus will hurl large icy-boulders and tree-trunks at the enemy, with a range of 50 yards. He will not follow enemy players more than 30 yards from his path, at which point he evades out of combat and resumes his march to the base.
Upon reaching the enemy base, Lok-vus will begin to attack it. The bases aren�t really destructible, but the enemy general will send out lots of troops in a (futile) attempt to stop him. Every time Lok-vus kills one of these troops(and he will kill a lot of them), the enemy looses R.
Lok-vus is an important part of your strategy and you should protect him, because if he dies, your side will loose 300 R. This is to encourage players to travel with and defend Lok-Vus rather than just summoning him and sending him off like a guided missile.
You can only summon Lok-vus once per battle.
(cont. below)|||Timer: There is also a timer on the battle. If 1 hour passes and neither team has won, then both sides "lose" the conflict, and the generals inflict an "honor penalty" in disgust of the incompetence of their troops. This is to both prevent the battle from dragging on indefinitely (like AV used to) as well as encourage people to make riskier and more daring attempts at offense as they get more desperate to win.
Please note, I dont really like the idea of having timers in BG, but I feel its necessary to keep AV in line with most of the other BGs, especially with the added abilities for gaining R.
Armor: Another forum poster, Mered, made the excellent point that NPC damage should be reduced by Resillience. You can read his post and my reply at the bottom of page 1/top of page 2.
Trinket: AV has a nice little addition to its rep grind (that I think many people arent aware of); as you increase your rep level you can get and upgrade a trinket that lets you port back to your home base from anywhere on the battlefield. Unfortunately, this trinket maxes as a level 60 item, like all the WoW Vanilla PvP BG gear. It would be nice if Blizzard made the exalted version of the trinket an heirloom type item that upgraded itself at levels 70, 80, and 85, so that wearing it wouldnt be a complete waste of a slot.
You can read all about the AV trinket on the wowwiki webpage, but basically you earn an upgrade at each rep level, and 2 at exalted (the second at 999/1000). Since the stats on the tinket are pretty minimal, I would recomend that we bump all the trinkets down a rank, and eliminate the rank 1 trinket entirely.
The new exhalted level trinket is the only one that scales upwards with level. At each level it provides the following stats:
Level 60 (no change)
+10 Frost resistance
+24 Dodge rating
Restores 8 health per 5 sec.
Use- Returns you to the sanctuary of your home base.
Level 70
+24 Spell Resistance
+34 Dodge rating
+22 Crit rating
Restores 14 health per 5 sec.
Use- Returns you to the sanctuary of your home base.
Level 80
+46 Spell Resistance
+48 Dodge rating
+42 Crit rating
Restores 24 health per 5 sec.
Imbues your armor with a protective layer of frost, reducing all damage you take by 1%.
Use- Returns you to the sanctuary of your home base.
Level 85
+70 Spell Resistance
+80 Dodge rating
+90 Crit rating
+110 Mastery rating
Restores 104 health per 5 sec.
Imbues your armor with a protective layer of frost, reducing all damage you take by 1%.
Use- Returns you to the sanctuary of your home base.
Summary: Readjusing the numbers and altering a few mechanics can, I think, bring back alot of the detail and PvP experience to the fight, hopefully without requiring a complete rebuild, or making the Battle un-winable again. The intent is to allow players a variety of options, along with several major paths to victory. Premades might be able to enact a coordinated stratgey, but PuGs can spilt up into several small groups to accomplish all the objectives. The entire raid really only needs to come together for a few big achievements.
For any players who never got to see the original AV in all its glory (such as myself) it would be like having a brand new BG with only a fraction of the work.|||My own thoughts in response to the above post:
It seems foremost problem in Alterac Valley, or any widescale battleground is not the balancing or anything so basic, but rather the fundamental playstyle.
There are only two primary playstyles to these battlegrounds, and any level or combination of compromise between the two.
- Players seek the objectives, ignoring PvP to whatever extent they can. This is, after all, the most efficient way to accomplish the instant ending mechanics of the battleground.
- Players are lost as to the objectives, often engaging in player combat, but are generally unaware of the battle as a whole. In many ways I like the greater feel of freeform environment and interaction this gives, but it is always disadvantageous not to be diving headlong into the fray. Those who wander might as well be afk in the meantime.
In short, this means that all non-extreme (immediate defense or zerging) strategies are heavily undervalued. In many AV battles combat is literally nonexistent until at least Frostwolf or Stormpike graveyards. People have neither the incentive nor effective means to take advantage of the environment (the best being a mere couple of ranged attackers stationed in a bunker), and as such the levels of entertaining more complex yet inexact warfare intrinsically available to the battlefield is wasted.
What I suggest is changing the battleground slightly by fundamental principals, but also largely according to the user interface structure. Essentially I am trying to make not only stopgaps (though I may unfortunately have to start with that until my ideas are refined) but a theoretically logical fix to both issues within the immediate playstyles. I will attempt to renegotiate �the game of battle� and encourage greater versatility and depth of play while keeping the players even more focused and aware of the battle at hand.
(Post continued below)|||We�ll begin with the �focus� part. Above all else, I am looking to tie the players into the battle, to invest them to the points of conflict in more ways than a mere mass of allies charging up a slope, which I can heal to aid while I myself move upward in a somewhat vague notion that the goal is up ahead, enemies between, with my forces consolidated here. I wish to increase that pressure, that need.
A healer should be willing to risk their necks to protect a charge, and supporting dps should be willing to leave their targets (even at cost of a killing blow) to save their healer. In short, it�s what every great team that remains in a PvPers memory is made up of and pushed by, but now existing for more than just those naturally more sporting players, and better rewarding such.
The first step: improve both the raid and mini-map heads-up displays. Players should be findable personally, not just by class, if the user wishes. There should be better ways for the raid or party frames (especially as I plan to make ones party, or in this case �fireteam� a much more shifting term) to better accommodate themselves in appearance reflective to the situation (range and perhaps even direction of the members indicated by the party frames).
That much is simply a part of user interface, and while a more complex mod might be ideal, the ideas behind it are still fairly simple. The actual new concept is this one: fire-teams.
Similar to a party, but varying in size and not a solid component of a raid (they will shift without changing the order of the raid), a fire-team will be the most effective structure for focused use in a raid.
From the start fire-teams will provide a much keener way to keep track of other players in the raid most important to you who also consider you of importance (an actual group, not just a hodge-podge tying of priorities). Players who queue as a group will be able to keep their same group structure, or even add onto or shave off of their original group makeup, when forming a fire-team at the start of the match. This is just another immediate incentive that should heighten team play in battlegrounds like Alterac Valley.
Forming fire-teams before the match begins is not only for players already grouped however. By the time the match actually starts, it is likely that every player will be within some fire-team. The creation of fire-teams is simple, but its opportunities are immense.
Upon entering the battleground (let�s assume you arrive a bit late, but with still plenty of time before the match starts) you will see all fire-teams already formed, arranged in somewhat of a columned order with all the members in them, their classes (shown by icon and general role), and their leader or leaders. Cursing over the column of a fire-team will give fly-out panel further details on the member�s specs, gearscore, and PvP experience, along with full-armor pictures of each. Actually clicking on a fireteam will retain the more detailed roster while showing a list of strategy priorities bulleted out (by premake and selected or free-typed), flags and waypoints on the map detailing strategy, and will contain a chat for that group.
(The chat is contained on the fire-team�s pane from the point of its creation so that no part of the strategy discussed will be missed by a new-joining member. Once the match starts, or upon clicking the �Merge Chat� button, the chat from both before and after the player joined will be sent to the player in a new chat window.)|||Examples of fire-teams and strategies:
Fire-team: Zerging recon 1 (player named)
Roster
[Leader]Foresail<Drd> |
| Gnomagic <Mge> |
| Tenassity <Drd> |
| Caldron <War> |
| Valeni <Shm> |
| Eagleye <Htr> |
Whatever; point is they’re made up of one HoT-heavy healer (Foresil), 2 melee (Feral Bearcat/Arms), and primarily ranged.
Battle strategyback up troops at Stonehearth GY by following movement along the horde side. Hit and run from there, then check on the Field of Strife. Flank behind those attacking Iceblood Tower and hit horde defenders from the rear, run to IBGY if pursued and distract guards, get out of combat, then mount up and head for Tower Point. Cover tower point using ranged until taken, then head for Frostwolf GY.
What this will look like primarily is a series of curving path arrows, with other arrows possibly straying from it and then reconnecting later or not at all (basically assuming that the troops will reconnect as they see fit later or will likely die). It will make its way across the map in accordance with the leader’s general idea as mentioned above, with markers for attacks, able to show the intensity or expected length of time of attack vs. a hit and run or flanking action, etc, just by the arrow, though additional icons might be made too.
[This will likely be done using opacity or color, or actual movement over time, such as if the player had simply drawn the arrow with his or her mouse and paused or circled around where he expected more time to be spent.]
So, what’s really going on here is that lets say… Tenassity arrived first and being among the very first players was assigned a generic original fire-team, and was made its leader by default. Foresail, Caldron, and Eagleye joined shortly thereafter, discussed strategy briefly, and decided that Foresail should run the team (seeing as she had the most battle experience and best ideas thus far) and decided on a hit-and-run style of attack using some fast stunners and primarily ranged. They invited the other ranged to fulfill this group makeup, and then checked themselves off as ready while talking with other fireteams.
[At any point in time before the match begins pressing the map button will not only show your waypoints but those of all other teams as well. After the match begins it will only show yours.]
That’s just to start this off, and is undoubtedly a more trivial part of the system. What’s really important is that you will always have a very good idea where your teammates are, can immediately signal each other (often in ways more effective than even ventrillo) with on-screen visible waypoints, targets focuses, warnings, etc. Additionally, fire-teams can purchase some more standard battleground equipment as a team. Fire-teams may also be able to resurrect team-members (at cooldown) at a place of their choosing, or even without a graveyard (and not by conventional spell-casting means).|||[Purchases are made through points determined by �Paradigm� which I�ve split into 4 groups: Defender, Attacker, Ambusher, and Scout. The reason for these four is because there is no action doable on the battlefield, nor was there ever such an action, that did not in some way fit into those categories, and furthermore they were the most appropriate for the separation of rewards. Also, these points from paradigms will be collected by each player in the team and remembered as belonging to the player who collects them, but spent as a team. If a player with points in certain paradigms leaves or joins, the team will have points in each affected paradigm affected respectively.]
This equipment has nothing to do with Storm Crystals, Armor Scraps, or Badges/Talismans. These will still be collected, but no longer have to be looted, now instead being sent directly to your faction�s coffers. Upgrades will be made automatically if no other option is available, but all active raid-scale summons and upgrade paths will be chosen by the raid leader.
Essentially, being in fire-teams keeps you close-knit and effective while generally bringing a lot more fun into the combat. Keep in mind you can leave fire-teams (the options given to you will be listed below shortly) or switch from one to another (it�s fairly common to switch out members heavy in a certain paradigm all into one group so they can purchase equipment for that goal. For example, if a few members of your team specialized in ambushing when the rest of your team would attack towers (covering them from below and taking out people who tried to escape their line of fire), you might switch them to a different team comprised mostly of ambushers to buy something like� a dwarven rifle barricade, or goblin land mines.
Without a Fire-team � The Free-man�s mission system
When you are entirely without a fire-team your goals simply become centered on yourself, in other words all objectives important to the battle near your position.
Let�s say you just respawned at Iceblood Graveyard after leaving your team, the horde is trying to recapture Iceblood Graveyard, there�s a conflict zone in the field of strife, and there�s always some scouting to do to the north, and an advance squad is attacking near Frostwolf graveyard. Essentially, you are immediately granted the ability to take up a mission for any of these events, placed fairly discreetly where your quest objectives would normally be. Simply click on any of them (cursing over them will give a small fly-out of the fire-team involved and the point on the map (real-time player dots and waypoints included, if any) and you�ll join the team.
Keep in mind you can still go without a team completely. It�ll just be more like normal, where the players are a little more wandering or hanging out in often unnecessarily large packs and as fewer are doing that it might be a little less doable than normal (not much, but a bit).
Again, the fire-teams are a way to
- Better organize forces to encourage more use of the map and team class/spec makeup.
- Give the battleground a little more intuitive feel while allowing for greater strategic complexity by being a little more focused, but also more rewarding in a less strict sense (it�s no longer just slaughter until 0 reinforcements or tower-rush the general).
- Give some fun rewards that should be able to creatively and humorously shape the battle and create some larger strategy �over time� (summoning troops, guardian flags, cavalry rushes, aerial bombardments, Forest lord, mortar volleys, mount upgrades, etc).|||I guess the "awareness" part was taken care of too, especially in the no current fire-team ideas... I probably should have mentioned these things a little better.
I realize this was not a particularly well-written post, and will likely take effort to modify it to better structure and clarity later.
Any constructive ideas or specific critiques will be very much appreciated.
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